As a seven year old child I was intrigued by the story of these two grown men who "rassled" like schoolboys and ended up becoming close friends acting just like brothers. I fantasized about what that relationship was like and what the wrestling was like throughout my pre adolescent, adolescent, and adult years. All of my archetypes and my need for frot / wrestling as well as masturbatory fantasies are caught up in these childhood images and continue to the present day.

abe

Interestingly enough, historians believe that Lincoln had homo-erotic experiences. They may have been of the frot wrestle type. I'll wager that he and Jack had a lot of male to male bonding in those cabins at New Salem.

When I got the Kennedy comic I was eleven. There were two books. The second had a quite to me exciting scene of Jack wrestling his older brother, Joe. Jack was on the bottom, Joe on top in what appeared to be a combination of grinding and rolling. Kennedy's feet were pressed tightly on both sides of the seat of Joe's jeans as he laid tightly on top of Jack's crotch in his tight jeans and Jack appeared to be in the process of rolling on top of his brother. The Roosevelt comic had a boy schoolboy pinning young Teddy as they struggled groin to groin. I can't tell you how many erections I had looking at these pictures. I was also intrigued at how close the friendship was in the Lincoln case between him and Jack as if the fight cemented the friendship and of course there was the fraternal connection between Jack and Joe. Being an only child and fatherless, I couldn't help but have a longing feeling as well as imagining a feeling of mutual warmth and even trust existed between the combatants.

these guys are havin fun

I didn't know why. Years later during a course on child psychology I asked my professor whether the nature of wrestling was rooted in violent, aggressive behaviour. He said no that it was rather an expression of attachment. These mainstream American comics lionising real people were also praising the intimacy and tenacity of these acts of combat. Those symbols as well as symbols from the westerns became combined in a love of wrestling that stimulated my masturbatory fantasies to this very day. I might add that westerns like "Big Valley" which showed a close intimacy between the combative half-brothers Nick and Heath (in one scene they wrestled each other in a Fourth of July Contest before the entire town) and "Rifleman" (in one scene he wrestled a man who thought he was Abraham Lincoln) reinforced these archetypes in my psyche. When I was twelve I had this yearning to wrestle a big older guy, a big brother figure, who would be wearing cowboy cut wrangler jeans and I imagined us rubbing and rolling around on the floor. I had wrestled with a boy who was three years younger and we did a lot of groin and crotch burning when we were twelve, but my fantasies were not realized until my college years and only partially.

I still have those feelings today and they are not the gay stereotype of oral or anal sex. I thought I might be stimulated by anal sex, but when I saw it in a video and the grimace of pain it was a turn off. I wasn't greatly excited by straight sex either and so I have lived a celibate life, thinking that my sexual development was arrested in some infantile form until I stumbled upon your website.

In closing, let me say that your website does an important service during this age of deadly STDs as well as clear the air in an age of intellectual and spiritual breakdown. I want to thank you.

reply from bill

hey john

you're welcome dude -- i'm glad the site has been so helpful for you and i hope it continues to be so

to that end John, i encourage you to read as deeply on our Personal Stories message board and in Warriors Speak and Heroes as you can

What is history?

one of the problems John had as a boy was he didn't know how ubiquitous homosex had been among men, and particularly men of the warrior class, prior to post-industrialized society

simply put, the rigid separation into "gay" and "straight" didn't occur until the 20th century

before then, most cultures supported and even celebrated homosexual acts -- though most condemned anal penetration

of course there were other cultures which condemned homosexual acts, usually defined as anal penetration

but no culture had a concept of people being exclusively homosexual, or any sense that such people might constitute a minority group

that made it far easier for men to be affectionate with each other, since no one was going to call them "homo" for doing so

we can see that quite clearly in the relaxed and casual displays of affection in these ancient paintings and 19th-century photographs

achilles binds his lover patroclus' wounds

greek athletes, like these wrestlers, trained and competed nude

and athletes were openly courted by other men

while in 19th century America, displays of affection between friends were common

so we can see that John's fantasies about same-sex contact in earlier times weren't just fantasies

What is sex?

the other problem John had was that sex, whether hetero or homo, had been defined for him as penetration

and since he wanted to wrestle and rub cocks instead, he thought there was something wrong with him

but there wasn't and there isn't

because sex isn't about penetration

what makes sex sexual and uniquely pleasurable is the rubbing of the erectile tissues of the genitals

in the case of a man and a woman, the erectile tissues are those of the penis, clitoris, and vaginal entrance

erectile tissues are found in the penis which is richly endowed with sensory nerve endings the glans penis is particularly sensitive while the skin of the scrotum is very sensitive

erectile tissues are found in the clitoris and around the entrance to the vagina which is richly endowed with sensory nerve endings the glans clitoris is particularly sensitive while the lining of the vagina is morphologically equivalent to the skin of the scrotum

A Man and a Woman

during penile-vaginal sex, the man rubs his phallus, a genital organ, against the tissues of the woman's clitoris and vagina, also genital organs, and she responds to his movement with movement of her own, moving her body so as to maximize the pleasure from and contribute to these rubbing sensations

the intense pleasure in the act results not from penetration per se, but from genital rubbing -- to repeat, it is mutual genital rubbing which produces the intense mutual pleasure of penile-vaginal sex

moreover, a significant portion of that pleasure comes from the man rubbing his phallus against the woman's engorged clitoris, part of which emerges from the surrounding tissue to form a glans, and all of which is the morphological equivalent of his phallus

in addition to those erectile tissues in the clitoris, there are erectile tissues located around the vaginal entrance, which are also morphologically equivalent to those of the penis

these erectile tissues in the clitoris and vaginal entrance are richly supplied with sensory nerve fibers

during penile-vaginal sex, it is the rubbing of these genital tissues in both the man and woman which creates pleasure

penetration is incidental to sexual pleasure, and though necessary for procreation, sexual pleasure derives not from penetration per se but from the rubbing of the penis against the clitoral tissues and those near the surface of the vagina

and although the position of their bodies and the male's greater physical strength may suggest that the man is dominating the woman, in reality penile-vaginal sex is meant to be and usually is a co-operative act, a genital and spiritual union, in which each partner experiences intense genital pleasure based morphologically on erectile tissue, and in which each seeks to augment both their pleasure and that of their partner through maximizing the sensations generated by genital rubbing

A Man and a Man

in the case of two men, the erectile tissues are those of their phalluses -- cocks, dicks, and cranks

the erectile tissues of the penis are morphologically equivalent to those of the clitoris and entrance to the vagina

the glans penis and the glans clitoris are morphologically identical, and for that reason are the most sensitive part of the genitals in both men and women

to repeat, in both men and women, those erectile tissues are morphologically identical, consisting of cavernous tissues that become engorged with blood and which are richly supplied with exquisitely sensitive sensory nerve endings

in fact, says biologist Sensei Patrick, "If you turn a woman's squirrel inside out, you essentially have a crank."

got squirrel?
no prob dudes
you got each other

and that's right

because the genital tissues of the male and female are morphologically equivalent

so when you rub cocks, morphologically you're doing the same thing, you're experiencing the same sort of sensorially intense and super pleasurable genital connection, as when a man and a woman connect through their genitals - cock, clit, and vagina

you're connecting and rubbing your sensorily rich erectile tissues with those of another person -- someone you desire and love

what about penetration?

penetration does not equal sex

it's true of course that for sex between a man and woman to be procreative, the man must enter the woman

but he enters the woman through contact with her erectile tissues, tissues which are designed to pleasurably lead his cock into her vagina while giving her maximum pleasure

so it's not penetration or even procreation which makes the act sexual

if procreative penetration were all that was needed, a man could impregnate a woman through getting some sperm from a pouch on his body, and placing it with his finger inside a pouch on hers

or like some insects, he could simply leave a spermatophore, a container of sperm, in a place where she could find it, and she could then put the sperm in her womb

human beings aren't made that way

rather, we're designed to enjoy sex, and to experience sex as the highest and most intense form of pleasure

venus and adonis

zephyr and hyacinth

that pleasure, which derives from the mutual rubbing of the erectile tissues of the male and female genitals, has inspired much of the creative output of the human race

so what sex is about, for men and women as well as for men and men, is mutual genital pleasure

penetration and sex aren't synonomous

procreation and sex aren't synonomous

but genitalia and sex are

true sex is genital sex

and both hetero and homo couples achieve genital pleasure through genital rubbing

If anal isn't sex, what is it?

at full penetration, anal sex looks like vaginal sex

but they're not remotely the same

because the anus isn't a vagina -- it doesn't have any of the elaborate structure, any of the erectile tissue, any of the exquisitely sensitive and rich sensory nerve endings which make vaginal sex so pleasurable for both partners

rather, the anus is an organ of excretion

it's only purpose is to move waste material and pathogens out of the body

yet, for more than 25 years, "men into anal," a practice which centers on the penetration of that organ of excretion and is consequently dirty, dangerous, and degrading, have told other gay men that if sex isn't anal, it's abnormal, and that frot (and wrestling) is a fetish

let's get real

frot isn't a fetish

it's genital - genital sex -- just like penile-vaginal sex

anal penetration, however, *is* a fetish

it's a sexual obsession with a non-genital organ -- the anus

look again for a moment at the delicate and intricate structures of the vagina, designed to accept and welcome a phallus and selectively guide its ejaculate to the womb while generating intensely mutual pleasure for both partners

then look at the anus

a little sphincter muscle at the end of a pipe filled with feces, its sole function is to control, somewhat, when a person has a bowel movement

this is an anus

it's also a fetish

sticking your dick in a hole full of shit is bizarre

imagining your anus is a vagina is weird -- and painful

artifacts of buttfuck culture:

a "bottombitch" displays "his" butthole
he literally wants to get fucked up

with the sneer that passes for a come-on among bottoms
a "pussyboy" presents his butthole for penetration

his shithole has been shaved so that it appears sanitized
it isn't -- it's as dirty as anyone else's

a sex pig -- aka slut or whore -- eats shit

"mancunts" present their asses for multiple partners
during sex, the "tops" will pass from ass to ass,
spreading pathogens as they go

dudes -- this is a self-hating, self-destructive culture

in fact, everything about anal culture -- the penetration, the effeminacy, the promiscuity -- is homophobic to the core

so not only is anal a fetish, it's a homophobic fetish

artifacts of buttfuck culture A tanned top fucks a pale, effeminized bottom, his fists clenched and face distorted with pain; surrounding them are tee-shirts sold on gay.com, reading "pitcher, catcher, tight end, wide receiver." The catalog copy boasts, "As seen on TV's 'Queer As Folk.' The Catcher shirt is married in spirit to the Pitcher shirt. Great athletic mesh sports design with an underlying dirty and direct message!...a subtle [sic] and naughty message... a subtle filthy message for bros in the know." At the bottom is the ultimate analist self-defining tee: PIG.

i'll keep saying so and you guys should too

don't let the buttfuck boyz get away with this shit

shit they push like a dealer pushes crack and meth

anal penetration isn't kewl, it isn't hot, it isn't adventuresome, it isn't daring

it's conformist

anal is what gay men expect other gay men to do, and what straight people expect gay men to do

doing anal doesn't prove you're a man, or even a gay man

all it proves is that you can do what you're told

and that's dumb

cause anal isn't even sex

it's dangerous, it hurts, it smells bad, and it messes with your head

so don't do it

and tell your buddies that you don't do anal, you don't like anal, you're not promiscuous and you're not effeminate, and you think men who are, are fucked up

Honor diversity?

don't be fooled by "honor diversity"

the buttfuck boyz have never honored us or anyone else who won't do anal

what they mean by honor diversity is honor bug-chasing, honor gift-giving, honor rimming, honor penetration, degradation, promiscuity, pain and death

i'll never do that, and you shouldn't either

dudes -- can you imagine Thor, Hercules, Samson, Lincoln, Armstrong, or any other true hero getting fucked up the ass?

not without destroying his life

that's the truth of it

so we offer men stark choices:

FROT phallus fidelity masculinity equality freedom pleasure health LIFE			anal anus promiscuity effeminacy submission subjugation pain disease death

choose frot

choose life

choose frot

choose life

choose frot

choose life

John was celibate -- that's sad

but John was also true to who he is and what he wants and what he believes