Bill Weintraub

Re: Why Warriors?

7-31-2002

hi terry

thank you for writing to me

i'm glad that there are aspects of the site which resonate for you

i also appreciate your comments about frot and anal -- particularly the prob tops have keeping it hard

of course there could be many reasons for that

but i think there's something inherently distasteful about anal, and that's the violation of the sensible social stricture against contact with feces

so when you're fucking somebody, you have to be in denial

in porn, the exterior of the anus is sanitized thru meticulous shaving, so that there's no suggestion of what the function of the anus actually is

but, like you Terry, when i've topped guys, sometimes it's been fine and sometimes i've been aware of just where i'm puttin my dick

and the latter is not erotic -- at least not for me, and it shouldn't be for anybody

re "Warriors"

first of all, there's no "ultra macho" content on the site -- it isn't there because i don't support it

and as i make clear in various places on the site, including the site guide, the word Warriors is in the title of our club to honor and encourage all those men who have stayed true to their dreams of frot and resisted the pressure and coercion to do anal

and that is the *primary focus* of the club -- to empower men into frot and end the deathgrip of anal penetration on the lives of men who have sex with men

now as it happens, a number of the men on the site are also into combat sports -- wrestling, boxing, martial arts -- and that includes me

but it's by no means a prerequisite for participation in the club -- though we do find an interest in combat sport a commonality

so many men into frot are also into some form of fighting -- not necessarily erotically, although again many of us love combat sports on two levels -- as sport and sexually

we don't know why that is -- we just know it's so, and we do talk about our " natural male sex aggression," which we feel combat sports and dickfites enable us to express

it is also the case that we support a masculine identity among men who have sex with men and do not support effeminacy

in my view, and that of many of our core membership, there are three elements in mainstream gay male culture which are destructive:

the dominance of anal penetration;

promiscuity; and

effeminacy

so another of our goals is to change the culture of men who have sex with men, and to move away it from those elements and towards a culture which is phallic, masculine, and monogamous

and we regard effeminacy, like anal and promiscuity, as not being biologically rooted but simply a cultural overlay

indeed it's my experience of gay life that very few gay men are what i would call truly androgynous -- rather, their effeminate behaviors are learned and assumed mostly after they've come out and been socialized into gay male culture and what is expected of them

in addition, our site has been increasingly attracting men who are str8-identified -- and that's no accident

many of those men are looking for a way to be intimate with another man without surrendering their masculinity

and we offer them a way to do that, and we agree with them that there's no reason for men who have sex with men to be less masculine than men who have sex with women

also -- and just speaking for myself -- i find most effeminacy and drag to be acutely misogynist -- and i think the community's stance that it's not pc to denigrate drag is dead wrong and based on a flawed or non-analysis of what drag actually is

so what we're about is a cultural analysis -- of why anal is dominant, and of the connections between anal and promiscuity and effeminacy

finally, a warrior identity has been important for me throughout my life

and though i don't want to make the warrior aspect of the site exclusionary, i do encourage men to examine the warrior ethos and take from it those aspects which will better and enrich their own lives

Terry

Re: Why Warriors?

7-31-2002

Hello Bill

Thank you for writing me back so quickly.

I'm into cross country biking and I guess when I'm out there doing that, there is a "Warrior" side of me that does come out, although generally I'm a pretty mild mannered person. So I guess when one pursues a very physical activity i.e. wrestling, boxing, tennis, biking, or whatever, a certain "Warrior" character has to emerge in order to do it well. So, I like the word "Warrior" all of a sudden, now that I've put it into the context that you place it. From now on when I'm out there bustin' my ass to get up a hill, or hoping I've ducked low enough to get under an over-hanging branch without fracturing my shoulder or skull, I'll remember that I'm a "Warrior".

I think you should have WARRIOR T shirts etc., Good identification, that would offend no one. You could wear them in Salt Lake City (for example) and who would be the wiser, except those that know.

Thanks for your site, and thank you for your response.

Bill Weintraub

Re: Why Warriors?

7-31-2002

hey terry

you're very welcome and that's great

so now i'll think of Warrior Terry on his bike, overcoming all obstacles

eventually we will have tee-shirts

but it's my intention to garner enough publicity for our site and what we believe that everyone will know what Cockrub Warriors stands for, and that

Terry The Maple Leaf Warrior

Re: Why Warriors?

7-31-2002

Bill

I did my first bike tour this weekend, for the MS Society, about 100 miles over two days. When the sun was hotter than hell and winds battering away at us on Saturday, and the rain pissing down, along with the thunder and lightening, and the winds (still) blowing on Sunday, I thought about the Warriors, and found it a real inspiration to keep going. When I crossed that finish line on Sunday, I thought, if this doesn't take a Warrior, I don't know what the hell does. I had a number of things that inspired me to push on (like a few guys in their spandex bike shorts in front of me) and the Warriors was one of them. Thanks for the inspiration. I'm looking forward to my next tour/race. I want a Warriors T shirt.

Thanks Bill.

PS

Go ahead and post my emails with my name and email address attached.

I think anonymity is commendable when it comes to acts of philanthropy, however for the most part I feel that if you don't want to put your name to it, you probably shouldn't be saying it and/or doing it. I don't jump and and down about my life style, but I don't retreat from a direct question about it either, nor am I ashamed of it, as you might gather.

So go ahead and do it for me, you, and Warriors in general.

TR

Re: Why Warriors?

8-25-2002

Several weeks ago, I was floored when I found this site. Like most of the others here, my preference has always been for frottage, though I didn't know it by this name. Frottage just feels natural. Phallic mating, as it is termed here, is one of the most powerful sexual experiences a man can have.

Bill, thanks for the clarification concerning the whole masculine/feminine thing. I am a gay man who has never had sex with a woman. I've always known I was gay. I'm not particularly effiminate, not promiscuous, don't engage in top-bottom role-play, and don't dress in drag. But get this: Most people can tell I'm gay. I'm just not masculine enough. (Also because I don't get involved with women, and I'm not out . . . People put 2 and 2 together.)

This site is awesome. Thanks and keep up the good work. Also, the artwork by Eros V is spectacular.

TR

Bill Weintraub

Re: Why Warriors?

9-2-2002

hey TR

i'm glad the site is so meaningful for you

i want to address this question of people being able to read you, and of being "not masculine enough"

of course never having met you it's impossible to know just what's going on with you personally, but i've said in general that gay men are robbed of their masculinity twice

the first time is when they're growing up and realize they're gay and that to be gay is to be less than masculine

a good example of fall-out from that youthful realization is what Naked Wrestler, who really is a wrestler, calls "the fag sports thing": gay kids avoiding HS sports because (1) they feel they're not masculine enough and (2) they fear they'll be read as gay

and the other is when they come out, and are acculturated into a system which encourages effeminacy

so more often than not when gay men are less than masculine, it's not a reflection of their core personalities, but is simply a fulfilling of societal expectations of how men who have sex with men should behave

i don't think this is terribly mysterious -- i know for myself that when i'm around gay men, my behavior will become somewhat "gayer," and when i'm around str8 men, particularly if they don't know i'm gay, my behavior becomes more masculine -- more assertive and more self-assured

and i think the latter is in general preferable

and it's one of the reasons i like being around str8 guys

of course str8 guys aren't perfect -- they can be macho, they can be homophobic -- which I call them on -- and they can be really awful blowhards

but i still feel that masculine qualities are to be preferred in most men most of the time

in an email to Jamie Turner of Fenway Community Health, the guy who accused me of being homophobic because i'm critical of the culture of femmes and bottoms, Chuck Tarver said the following:

Regarding your charge of homophobia, I suggest you read the site more closely. What Weintraub is pointing out is the misogyny inherent in gay male culture. He makes the point that it is connected to the anal culture. I don't know about you but I have often heard men refer to bottoms as "boy pussy, man pussy, sluts, bitches, hoes, miss thang, etc.

This blatant disrespect for the feminine is not Weintraub's doing. He merely points out its existence. Sounds to me like you're shooting the messenger. I know Bill well enough to know that he does not disrespect men who are naturally feminine, nor does he suggest that we ignore our feminine sides. What he decries is the psuedo feminization promoted by gay male anal sex culture.

Chuck's is an excellent summary of my views

so i think we get what the culture says we'll get

that's why i so often talk about the Greeks -- they expected men who loved men to be masculine and monogamous, and they were

and if we change our expectations, we'll change behavior

Sir Robert

Re: Why Warriors?

11-24-2002

The Greeks had the right idea and concept. As you say Bill, "They expected men who loved men to be masculine and monogamous, and they were." You also state, "and if we change our expectations, we'll change behavior" which relates to the basic premise of Cognitive Psychology (change the thinking, change the behavior). You are RIGHT and you couldn't be more right Bill. Edgar Cayce once said, "Mind is the Builder, Spirit is the Life, Physical is the Result". Our thoughts form our perceptions and expectations and as we change our thinking we also change our behavior.

Also, regarding the suggestion for T-shirt I think it is a GREAT IDEA and I would like to see this happen. As was suggested the shirts could have "Warrior" on them. But, since much of this site contains alot of Greek stuff the shirts could also have "Hoplite" on them. Just an idea.

I want a T shirt too...

Sir Robert